Karl Renz: If you go really back, it starts with the lingam, with awareness. That all starts. God became aware of Existence, to exist – and then it all starts. This is all the result of God became aware. The divine accident.

So, if you really want to know why – that’s because God became aware, started to dream, started to realize himself. And he has to realize himself, as he has to realize himself. He cannot decide how to realize himself. As he has no power of discrimination. He doesn’t even know what is good and bad. That is his absolute problem – he doesn’t know any good and bad. So, it needs one who knows good and bad, and what is cruel and what is not cruel. And then it’s too late anyway.

That what knows what is good and bad has no power. So, the dream object who has an idea, this mind, who calls something good and something bad, has no power at all. It’s already dreamed. And that what is dreaming it, has no discrimination. So, what to do.

So, that what is goodness doesn’t know what is goodness. And never know what is good and bad. And that what knows what is good and bad has no power. So, there is no way. That one has no reason to change something, because it doesn’t even know what is good and bad. And that what knows what is good and bad has absolutely no power. So, what to do.

So, from the personal point of you, you try to change something – humanity, you call these good and bad. Do your best. But you have no power. You see – since humanity is there, there is war. There is death and rape, and all what you… all bad. Not even the devil could invent what the human spirit is doing to each other. Crazy. I know.

But from the absolute point of you, there is not even humans who do something. So, what to do.

And I know this is unbearable – being a human on this earth and seeing all what happens – make you sick. From that point of you. If you look from that point of you of whatever, you think – will it ever change, this is really too much, unbearable, how can I get out of it. Yeah. It’s all too much.

And when you ask me – What to do? I would say – be what you cannot not be and That never had any problem.

But for that now what has problems with this life and all of that, that will always have problems. It’s never good enough. It will always try to make it his way.

So, that what you believe to be is a little fascist, who tries to make something better. It’s like little Hitler inside, who wants to save the world his way. Because he knows how it has to be. So, everyone who wakes up in the morning – little Hitler wakes up. Little fascist who knows better then God himself how it has to be.

Karl Renz: Yeah, it should be attractive. Totally attractive. So, I am a flower which doesn’t care if you would like me or not.

Question: Right. You are the flower in the middle of the forest, there just flowers and who sees it.

Karl Renz: Doesn’t expect being seen and appreciated as beautiful or not.

So, that is maybe the absolute intelligence who doesn’t care to be intelligent or not. No idea. Bla-bla-bla.

Question: When you say – there is only one handful of serious people who come to Tiru.

Karl Renz: Yeah.

Question: What do you mean by serious?

Karl Renz: Serious, it’s like the 63 Shiva lovers who are now the siddhas around Arunachala. They were serious. Because only Shiva counted for them. They gave only attention to Shiva and not to party. Not to whatever. Not a bhajans singing, or anything. No distraction. They were just one-pointed, only – Shiva. And then they become the 63, being like a cloud around Arunachala.

And that is very rare. Nisargadatta said, there is any given time maybe a handful in the whole world who are as one-pointed as that for themself. It’s rarest of the rarest.

Millions go to church. Millions pray for God. Millions whatever. And praying for some – the sun would go to the universe, some money for the new car and something. They are millions. They are very religious, but praying for business. But this one-pointed and this totally termination of suiciding. Suiciding what you are. Only one side. Only the sui-cide. Total suicide for what you are. It’s the rarest of the rare.

Before, there are many awakening satsangs and thing… It’s all like… whatever.

But they say – it needs this termination. You have to be terminated, and only one this counts. Nothing else counts. Day and night. 24/7. And not like 1 hour satsang. And maybe 2 hours bhajans singing. Or going to Ramana temple, or anything. Or giving attention for 10 minutes or 5 hours, and counting the minutes. It has to be 24/7 365. And nothing else counts. Day and night. Are you ready for that? That it happens. It happens when it happens.

And mostly it’s about pain. Only pain makes you that or the suffering. When it becomes so unbearable. That the only way out is That. To be What you are. It’s like want which is hurting permanently, 24/7. This longing inside which is unbearable. That already by grace is there. And not by wanting it.

Normally you want to cover it. You want to heal yourself. And all that healing and thing is actually contra productive. You have to leave it open. You have to make it more intense. If you go for it. And not healing your heart, and healing your childhood, and family constipation. And all of that. It’s just contra productive.

Just go for the one – for this longing. For this depression. This pressure. Under pressure. Totally under pressure. So. What to do.

Karl Renz: So, enjoy yourself, because this never had any beginning and never will have any end.

So, as I said, joy is your nature. Out of joy joy appears. Joy is all there is.

Question: Can we choose joy?

Karl Renz: Choose?

Question: Can we redirect yourself? Like – this is more joyful.

Karl Renz: Yeah, even that is part of joy. Even more joy cannot bring you more joy. And less joy – not less. But there is an imaginary experience of more joy and less joy. But by that more joy you will not become more joy, and by less joy you will not become less joy. Existence experiencing itself by more existence and less existence. But experiencing by more existence, it doesn’t become more. And by less existence – not less.

So, the quality of what you are has nothing to gain. There is an experience of more and less. That’s all. But by more or less there is… what? Nothing to gain or to lose. But you cannot… There is no choice in it.

It’s like the choicelessness creates the chooser, a choosing, what can be chosen. But by whatever the chooser is choosing, and whatever is chosen, choicelessness cannot be reached. But choicelessness is always the goal for whatever you try to do. So, whatever you wish for is wishlessness. Because that is ananda or happiness. The absence of one who needs or doesn’t need anything. Of one who is happy or unhappy – that is happiness itself.

But out of that what is happiness itself, happy or unhappy one is rising. So, it’s a rising and disappearing all the time. Of unhappy or happy one. Sometimes happy, sometimes unhappy. But already the happy or unhappy one coming out of that what is happiness. So, even the unhappiness is happiness. Existence. And the nature of Existence is happiness. And what can happen. In all that happenings. Only happiness experiencing happiness. And even in unhappiness. So, even the unhappy or happy one is in his nature – happiness. Happy. Happy.

Question: So, it is a conditioning to look for a happy ending?

Karl Renz: Whatever looks for a happy ending, it is imagining that he has a beginning. And whatever is imagining to have a beginning for sure by loving himself or whatever, by that loving-caring business of a lover caring about himself trying to make a happy end out of it.

So, in this instant you become something, you are something what has a beginning, like this body has a beginning, the soul has a beginning and end, or whatever. Or even imagining that you exist, you doubt that existence. You are looking for the beginning because you want to control yourself. No way out.

Then you are very busy. Of course, in that loving-caring business you only want to have the best for yourself. The best guru, the best understanding, the best inner vision or outer vision. Only the best is good enough for what you are. Not less. Only the best. I don’t go for less. That is called love. What else. But the best cannot be found, thanks God.

So, you will never be satisfied by second best. And second best is awareness. It’s not bad. But it’s only second best. And your satisfaction is not in second best. The satisfaction is only in that what is goodness itself. So, second best is not good enough. Only goodness itself is good enough for you to be.

And even every other, what is so called experience of so clarity, and energetic, and everything is clear, and all that – is all second best. If it all. And never good enough.

And in an instant you see – it will never be good enough, and suddenly you are the goodness itself. Which is only that to be what is that is good enough for you. And there is satisfaction which is never depending on any so called understanding of any kind of sensational – block of existence or manifest, or not-manifest, and all of that what you can imagine. Fuck it all in that instant.

Yeah, it’s true. It’s really like – pufff, so what?

Question: How to root out the expectation?

Karl Renz: By grace there will be no expectation, but not by your wanting it. If your suffering is deep enough, your despair or your longing is strong enough, you will surrender to That.

Your surrendering will happen by… It will feel like a rape. As something is raping you. And you have no other choice then giving your attention to That. It’s not your choice. You will never do it by choice. It’s just – you cannot avoid it. That you give only attention to That. And it will happen in spite of your wanting it or not. It’s not in your hand.

That’s why it calls grace. Grace will do it. Carelessness. It doesn’t even know you. It shows no mercy. It will just… And you will say – “Oh, I feel like rape, I don’t want that.” But you have to do it. It’s like the people who go to the caves or hermits, or to Arunachala to sit there, it’s not by choice. They may see – “Oh, I chose now to go.” No, it’s not their choice. Circumstance dictates. It’s a total dictation of Totality. That you have to do it. It’s not that you can – “Now I do it and then bla-bla-bla. Just for holiday, now I make this and this…” It’s a total demand of Totality. That you have to do it, in spite of your wanting it or not.

But without that demand of Totality it cannot happen anyway. So, if it’s meant to happen, it will happen. But not by your having an idea – it will be nice or something. Whatever advantage. No. What is meant to happen, will happen. In spite of your liking it or not.

I just sit here and tell you – don’t mind. Because this is not a rape. This is grace. This is just like a callback into whatever. And the destruction of your so called precious things, and that you have to let go of thing… Enjoy it. Don’t take it personal. And the suffering is nothing bad, and the despair, because is part of grace. And it’s not something what one should – poor me or something. No. “Yes! Take me. Hallelujah. I am not ready, but take me anyway.”

Because no one will ever be ready for That. If you wait to be ready for That, you will wait forever. You will never be ready. It will take you, in spite of your being ready or not. That is like you are already in the tiger’s mouth if you like it or not. And you will be swallowed. And it doesn’t feel good. And it’s not meant to feel good. It’s not like doctor Feelgood comes and takes you in your arm, and leads you to heaven. And then you are swimming in a wellness of whatever bla-bla-bla. Blissful. No, it is a rape. It’s not what you wish for. It’s not what you expect. It’s maybe the totally opposite.

Karl Renz: It’s not about understanding. It’s really… You will see this whatever few days, you will – let him talk. You just maybe… there is like a good company that there is no company. And you just – pfff. Maybe the carelessness just comes by nature. Or is there. You neither care or don’t. This intention to understand or anything… It’s all goes to zero. And then you are what you are anyway. It’s great, yeah.

So, I try to talk you all to death. I mean it. Then you sit here and then… As long I talk, you don’t have to do anything. You just… You are neither here or not here.

Suddenly you start to enjoy not to know. To know or not to know.

Long time ago I stopped to try to make sense. Long time ago. I think nonsense is fantastic. The enjoying the nonsense of life. It doesn’t need to make sense. Wonderful. No need it all. Wow.

This senselessness of being. Unbearable for the person. Joy for your being.

So, maybe you create the absolute preference that let this unsatisfied bastard be as it is. Who fucking cares. You will be never satisfied anyway. You try your best to satisfy this bastard, this your beloved whatever. And it’s always like… That is like Shiva goes hunting, because Parvati cannot be satisfied. Yeah, that’s the story. He comes back with this biggest prey and biggest understanding, and truth, and thing, and – “You can do better”.

Question: Can we call this enlightenment?

Karl Renz: No, this is… No. This is not even realization. This is the realization that That what one is – is ever realized. It’s more like… You cannot name it. It’s a non-event. Every event before, whatever oneness, whatever experience of deep insight of enlightenment, when that what is awareness… when matter and antimatter merge, and the light is there – even that… as I said, for fifteen years I was walking as that nothing, as light.

But there was still the heart-knot. Because I was defining myself as that light. So very subtle ownership – my light. And in that split second that ownership dropped out. It was even the physical dropping out of existence – being prior to Existence. And then you…

But you still are in that world, but you are not of it. As the world is of you. But this is not oneness. As there is no one who defines himself in anything. This is was simply there, in every given moment. In every given moment it was there. And simply by giving the attention to the outside, to that dream, not aware of that.

But in that instant the awareness totally turned around to that what is awareness. And then there is no out-going or in-going. As you are simply that what is. But not by any definition.

So, that the absolutely not knowing what you are – is absolute knowledge. And everything is included in that. In that emptiness. And only that emptiness of that what is heart, the totally emptiness of any idea or definition can contain the fullness of that what is the realization of that what is heart.

That’s why the buddhists call so much attention to that emptiness, to go to that heart of emptiness. As you become that what is emptiness. And when you are that what is emptiness, it calls the outburst into that everything, into that fullness. And reaching the extreme emptiness, by being that emptiness – you are out to the fullness. And there is no contradiction in anything.

So, the whole totally koan of “me” is breaking down, in that instance.

Karl Renz: When you are what you are – it’s all fantastic. It’s all fantasy. But when you are part of the fantasy, you cannot find it fantastic. You are what you are, or not. There is no bridge. There is no little bit being what you are.

When you are what you are, what you cannot not be – fantastic. When you are little bit not what you are – you are already out of it. You are it, or not. There is no between. No between. There is no bridge to anything. And there is no 20%. There is no percentages of anything. Even 100% is not enough.

Question: And where is the gap if there is no bridge?

Karl Renz: There is no gap. That’s the problem. No gap. If there would be a gap, there could be a bridge. First, find a gap and then we can maybe make a bridge. But not finding a gap, maybe – then OK. Who needs the bridge?

Question: So, Karl, when you are what you are, there is no suffering?

Karl Renz: Every night when you are without any whatever experience, you are. I just call it – the absolute absence of any presence of any whatever you can imagine. Just being what is not an imagination.

Just being not what is an imagination. Everything else is a mirage. It’s like a something, you don’t know. Mirage. It’s like in a desert, you see – there is like a lake, but it’s just a mirage. It’s just a light flickering like something.

Question: Illusion.

Karl Renz: Yeah, call it whatever.

Question: Some call it dream, illusion.

Karl Renz: The dream is only that you think you can escape what you are. That’s the dream. The rest – I don’t know what it is.

Question: And what about the suffering which is there. Are you still suffering?

Karl Renz: Absolutely. How can I not suffer about myself. But do I mind?

Question: That’s it. Is there any issue in this?

Karl Renz: Yes, sometimes it is an issue. But does it make me less if there is an issue?

Question: Yes, but this is the point.

Karl Renz: No, but I am not… I don’t get less by anything. But that is the treasure I am talking.

Question: I don’t mind.

Karl Renz: Yes, but not minding is too much minding for me. Minding or not minding. Mind or no mind – never mind.

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